2355 Refret - value loss

[Stefan74]

Hi everybody!

Half a year ago I bought an 2355 made in 1977 via ebay Italy for €507 (US$ 750 )+ shipping. The guitar has been played a lot so the sound is great while the condition is still good. Only the frets are worn out and a refret is inevitable.

Can anyone tell if the guitar looses its value completely if I got it refretted?

Kind regards Stefan

[gemberbier]

Welcome Stefan,

If leveling and beveling (crowning job) does not work anymore, you have an ACTUAL situation of value loss at this very moment: it is not playable anymore.
In order to get it playable again you MUST invest in a refret job.
If a neck is BOUND, this could mean damage to the binding.
This is NOT the case with the 2355.
But it will cost you about € 150.-
Bound fretboard jobs are more expensive.

Take it to a good professional luthier with decent prices.
This operation will increase the value compared to the actual situation.


Ginger

[bobzilla]

I would have thought that since a re-fret is such a standard/inevitable thing to do to a guitar, that the answer would have been a straight "no" to...
"does a re-fret devalue a guitar."

Now... re-fin is quite another story but re-fret, I would think, would never devalue a guitar and... quite the opposite... it should always increase the value because... you just saved potential buyer a chunk of change, around $300.
That's $300 going into the axe, thus... increasing the value.

If binding is an issue, and it may be in certain instances, it's almost another topic/consideration. Not quite, but almost.

[Stefan74]

Hi Ginger!

Thanks for the nice welcome!

Well the guitar is playable BUT as the luthier who made the set up said: "it will play and sound better with a refret".

The guitar has the kind of binding on the fretboard that covers the end of each fret (don't know the exact term) and the luthier said that this small parts of the binding will be removed through a refret.

I will do the refret anyway but I was just curious if the loss of values is any significant. I also know that the guitar is not a particularly rare one so its value is not so high.

Cheers Stefan

BTW check out this offer (already expired) for an 2470: http://cgi.ebay.at/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260240897509

[Stefan74]

I would have thought that since a re-fret is such a standard/inevitable thing to do to a guitar, that the answer would have been a straight "no" to...
"does a re-fret devalue a guitar."

Now... re-fin is quite another story but re-fret, I would think, would never devalue a guitar and... quite the opposite... it should always increase the value because... you just saved potential buyer a chunk of change, around $300.
That's $300 going into the axe, thus... increasing the value.

If binding is an issue, and it may be in certain instances, it's almost another topic/consideration. Not quite, but almost.

Hi Bobzilla!

That's exactly the way I think, but I've heard that some collectors don't accept any changes to the guitar even if it is not playable in this conditions. But probably concerning my 2355 this is not an important aspect.

Cheers Stefan

[bobzilla]

Yes, Stefan, sure that's true sometimes, but it's whacky because...

if you sold an axe to a guy and the axe needed a re-fret and there was no way around it, the buyer would have to re-fret or...
not play the axe and why buy it if you can't play it?

(yes, I have guitars I've never played but that's by choice not because of fret issues.)

But, I'm sure it's rue sometimes, regardless of how whacky it seems on the surface.
me personally, I would never let a re-fret be a negative when considering buying an axe, I'd consider it a positive.
However, if binding needed to be trashed to any extent to accomplish the re-fret, that may be a different story.

With these vined old IBZ's, the inlays become a consideration when refretting or doing anything major to the neck so, in a vine re-fret, I'd pay more attention to what went on there, before considering a purchase on a re-frettted viner.

[p90talman]

I have a Vintage Fender Telecaster on which I've worn the frets down to almost nothing. When I was looking to get a refret done I was told a refret would lower the value. My argument is that, as a player's guitar, it has less collectors value and with worn frets limited functionality. If a guitar has been played enough to wear the frets down then the value should be improved if the functionality of the instrument with a refret. Forget about the fussy collectors they seem more interested in museum pieces whereas a real musician will appreciate the value of a quality instrument.

[bobzilla]

a quality "playable" instrument... that is.

[gemberbier]

I have a Vintage Fender Telecaster on which I've worn the frets down to almost nothing. When I was looking to get a refret done I was told a refret would lower the value. My argument is that, as a player's guitar, it has less collectors value and with worn frets limited functionality. If a guitar has been played enough to wear the frets down then the value should be improved if the functionality of the instrument with a refret. Forget about the fussy collectors they seem more interested in museum pieces whereas a real musician will appreciate the value of a quality instrument.

Just like bound fretboards, lacquered maple ones are also a problem when you pull the old frets out. It may end up pretty ugly.

You won't have this problem with an unbound non-lacquered rosewood, ebony or pao ferro fretboard. Such fretboards can be cleaned with steel wool and should be fed with a few drops of fretboard oil after cleaning.

Now, the 2355 is a ES-175D replica with a unbound rosewood fretboard with simple DOT inlays. If the fretboard is not too dry, properly fed with oil, the chance of damaging the fretboard is not so big. So clean and oil it first.


Ginger

[toms_korber]

The guitar has the kind of binding on the fretboard that covers the end of each fret (don't know the exact term) and the luthier said that this small parts of the binding will be removed through a refret.

Now, the 2355 is a ES-175D replica with a unbound rosewood fretboard with simple DOT inlays.

So either Stefan's guitar isn't a 2355 or Ginger is mistaken about the specs of an 2355

[gemberbier]

The guitar has the kind of binding on the fretboard that covers the end of each fret (don't know the exact term) and the luthier said that this small parts of the binding will be removed through a refret.

Now, the 2355 is a ES-175D replica with a unbound rosewood fretboard with simple DOT inlays.

So either Stefan's guitar isn't a 2355 or Ginger is mistaken about the specs of an 2355

I was mistaken. I was just too lazy to take my 2355m out of the case. At the moment I have my 1988 Artstar AC100 in the stand, which is as simple as I described.

The 2355 has bindings of course and MOP parallelogram inlays (not even DOTS).

The AC100 is a mix of an early ES335 DOT (no sustain block) and an L-5CES, it's more like a simple Byrdland, even a little shallower.

So, it will be more complex and more expensive to do it right. Perhaps € 225-275 or even more. That depends on the luthier of course. Perhaps Bobzilla's estimate of $300.- is realistic for the USA. I understood that luthiers are very expensive in the USA.

Thanks for keeping your eyes open Toms.
I wasn't fully awake. I fell asleep on the couch watching Dr House last night, and when I woke up, one of the PCs of the boys was still on. Just had to look what was cooking on ICW...
I didn't feel like going to bed that early in the morning, because I planned to see my GP without an appointment, so I had to be there early.


Ginger

[Stefan74]

Hi guys!

Yes, my guitar is the model with parallelogram inlays and also with binding. I just wanted to thank you for your replies - I do appreciate the numerous contributions to my question!

Well, and as I mentioned before, I will have the guitar refretted within the next few months.

Cheers Stefan

[aeh]

Stefan, of course you should refret your guitar. I mean, you do change the strings too once in a while. Old strings affect playability as well as worn frets. As for the binding, you pay the luthier to worry about that.
Cheers
A

[toms_korber]

I fell asleep on the couch watching Dr House last night

 

 

(if that was the 1st episode of the new season - the one featuring his '67 Flying V - I could tell you how it ended... )